They only guide us through the basics, the rest is a challenge to figure out that they only give us bits and pieces to guide us with. I am not going to use this program until there are tutorials making sure I know how to make text adventures in a way that is most convenient for the text adventure creator. I am not going to spend hours on something that will normally take ten minutes and I am very frustrated! I will not progress until there are actually guides on how to thoroughly use this program instead of this maze of information in the forums that barely scratches the surface and the quest documentation site which is super vague on everything.

This thread is for venting and complaining and/or doing something about poor tutorials.

This is my opinion as an eighteen year old. I understand this may be immature of me, but I strongly want better tutorials.

Have you found the "How to..." guides? They take you a bit further, though in some specific directions.
http://docs.textadventures.co.uk/quest/guides/

Quest is easy for doing the basics, and the tutorial covers that, but if you want to make a really good game, you need somethng original. Quest almost certainly has the capability to do that, but by its nature no one will have done it yet, so it is not covered in the tutorial or the basic functionality.

I have the same problem (Although I am very much at the other end of the age scale !) I have now spent many hours trying to implement what I thought would be relatively simple. I simply wanted to create a locked door in a room which was also not visible (the door that is ! ) When a key was obtained in a second room then by taking the key and entering the first room the door becomes visible and can be unlocked with the verb (unlock) which I have created. Finally got that working BUT wherever I am with the key if I click it then one of the options in the popup is unlock which doesn't make sense particularl since if it is selected the message for unlocking the door appears . I have searched all the documentation I can find to no avail. Much of it contains (to me) incomprehensible code. I really don't like giving up on things and feel sure that this program more than any other will do what I want but I really am getting so frustrated that I may have to do just that. I am not going to admit to being immature (far from it) but could very well just have become dimmer with advancing years so maybe its just me ... on the other hand I have succesfully programmed microcomputers and once (long ago) wrote a text adventure from scratch in BASIC similar to that I am now trying to create.

I'm a newbie myself and often get other people extremely frustrated with helping me! But...here's how I would solve the problem.

Quest has objects: Physical Objects, and Object Rooms.

I am assuming you have a "key object" and a "room object" already as you stated in your previous post. Here are step by step instructions in the GUI editor.

1. Erase the verb on your "key" since it's really unneeded.

2. Next find your "room" and the "exit direction" that the locked door is on.

3. Create the appropriate exit (if you haven't yet), and then click on the direction.

4. Click on your "exit direction" and give the locked direction a name. click off the "visible" box and click on the "locked" box.

5. Go to the "key object" and search for the "features tab" on it --- then click on the tab.

6. Check "Use/Give" What that does is allow your key to be used on your desired object much easier and much more precisely.

7. After you've clicked on "Use/Give" ...go to the "Use/Give tab"

8. You'll see a list now, "Use (on it's own)", "Use (other object) on this", "Use this on (other object)" and so on. We want to use the first one, "Use (on it's own)"

9. Click on the "Action "None"" box directly below "Use (on it's own)"

10. Search the list and find, "Run Script"

11. Make an "If" script.

12. On the "If Script" select, "player not in room"

13. Keep it an "object" and then select "your room name"

14. After that find, "then" on that script, select "Add New Script" --- find "Print a message" (very first selection I think at the very top).

15. Type something like, "You can't use this here..." What this does is...if the player is NOT in the correct room with the key it won't show or open. Another words the key cannot be "used" yet.

16. Click on "Add Else If", "Add New Script" and find "Make Exit Visible" click it and then select your room.

17. Next "Add New Script" to that "Else If" (don't make a new "else if script") and add "unlock exit" and click on your "lock name" from the list.

18. Now if you want the key to be dropped after the door is visible and unlock click "Add new script", "remove object" and select your key.

Now when the player enters that room, they shouldn't see that exit. When they obtain the key however, it'll make the exit visible and when the key is used in the autogenerated verb list it'll unlock the door and discard the key.

Let me know if this works! Hope I helped!

Hi
Brilliant step by step instructions .. Nearly there now. I am still getting an error when I try to use key in appropriate room i.e.
Error running script:Error compiling expression ":SyntaxError: Unexpected end of fileLine:1, Column:1
I have no idea what this means or where to look for it and identify the piece of code referred to.. Probably got something to do with some redundant code I have left in there ! But many thanks, just the sort of help I was lookin for. Trouble is one doesn't like to keep poppingg upon the forum with what may seem to others to be dumb questions ! Thanks again !

When it comes to forums about asking questions for game programming, if it isn't listed somewhere very obvious that you have been given the resources to find without too much trouble, then it's not a stupid question. Even if its not relevant to most people right away, there's a pretty fair chance that this knowledge will benefit quite a few other users that happen to stop by this thread.

EDIT: as for the tutorials, yes they could be better, but at the same time that's a good chunk of work someone has to be willing to go out and do themselves. Also in my opinion at least, understanding the coding logic of how to accomplish what you want is far more important than highly detailed steps to achieve very specific results, as the first will allow you to build a lot more once you understand the basic tools you have available. It's one of those things that's a lot harder to get across in a tutorial environment than it would seem it should be.

Something to keep in mind, and those of you with previous coding experience should know this to some degree, but try to keep it in mind, that many things that seem conceptually simple tend to not be so simple when it comes to coding.

My advice is when you seem to be hitting a dead end, try to really break down your problem into as many basic parts as you can and try to look at how you need the game to go about each of those parts to get your end result. And if all else fails, or heck even before that, stop by the forums and ask about it. That's really a major part of what these forums are for, and you never know how many people may be running into similar problems.

Oh! I should have probably said so, but make sure ALL of your spellings are exactly the same. For example, if you have...

Name: creepy_room
Alias: Dark and Creepy Room

Then the name have to match the original room name, not the alias.

If you need to. Try restarting an entirely new room and key and just follow the instructions again. If you get the same error then I'm leaving something out, if not, then it was something left in your old code.

Hi again.
Tried new game with just three rooms and get the same error. The list of instructions for the GUI make perfect sense to me so I still can't see what is wrong. In reply toTinFoilMkIV I agree with much of what you say . A lot of people have put a great deal of work into this and I would not wish to criticise them for what I think is a great gift to us. However the phrase you use:

Also in my opinion at least, understanding the coding logic of how to accomplish what you want is far more important than highly detailed steps to achieve very specific results, as the first will allow you to build a lot more once you understand the basic tools you have available.

I do not entirely agree with for the following reason. I am not familiar with coding but desire to learn. At this early stage all attempts to understand the problem have failed after very many hours , leading as I have said before to almost giving up. The step by step detail so kindly provided by Neonayon will not only allow me to move forward with my game, but I can also look at the code involved to achieve someting which is important to me and by so doing learn more about the coding ..Having said that we all learn in different ways ...Hope all that makes sense .... Now, back to trying to locate that blasted syntax error

you can search through my posts... though I have a lot... lol

I do have some posts where I go into step by step detail, and for the gui-editor too, but most of my posts are code posts, but if you're interested in learning to code, my posts can be very useful.

I've used quest to learn to program, and if I can learn to program, any one can!

---------

P.S.

this is why~what XanMag is doing with his sample games, he's trying to get these sample games posted, as more tutorials...

the tutorials and guides were mostly written when quest initially came out, ~ 3+ years ago, and unforuntately, not many people have since added to the tutorials. Pixie is our best, most tutorials and guides are his~her. It's a lot of work though, and that's probably why not many people have made more tutorials and guides and etc. We're waiting for people to do it, as it's a lot of work... so, no one does it, we're too busy ourselves, waiting - hoping for someone else to do it, lol.

Thanks for that . I have already found some of your (simpler !) posts helpful. I am howeverr at a very basic level. I am trying to track down an error which I have mentioned in the earlier post. I have switched to code view (although I am not clear what language I am looking at). I understood that it was Quest's own language , and there are no books on that . My error is (Unexpected end of fileLine:1, Column:1) Where the devil do I find that ? There are no line numbers and what does it mean by columns ? Meanwhile I will reread some of your posts !

the 'end of file' is not a common quest error ... the good coders here can probably help quick with why its happening... I'm not that knowledgeable enough... if it's not quest related, have you any code that tries to read from a data or whatever file, as this is the usual cause of an 'end of file' error.

a file is read character-or-line by character-or-line, if you tell the program to read-get more characters-or-lines than are in the file, then you get the 'end of file' error.

----------------

P.S.

game making, as is coding, learning or developing~making, must be done slowly... take your time, and start small.

yes, this is VERY HARD to do, I know!, I want to jump in and make an epic massive RPG game... until I realize that... oh $@$%$%, I don't know how to do that... doh!, go back to boring learning to code again.... and this repeats over and over... it's hard to do, as you want to jump right in, but you got to take it small, step by step, get excited for learning very small things, and eventually, those small learnings build up, and you find yourself actually able to do more with your game making, then you realize.

-----------

P.S.S.

I think there's an unfortunate inverse relationship with designing a game engine:

if~as you make a game engine be able to more easily do things, the less things you can actually do with it.

if~as you make a game engine being able to do more things, then it's going to be more abstract-open, which means less things can be already built-in, meaning that you got to create or do them, yourselves --- (more difficult for non-coders or noob-coders).

we do need more tutorials, but no one wants to do them, lol. We can only blame ourselves, we need to give back to quest and write tutorials to help others, but we don't (or just don't have the time... if we do want to do so, to help others).

quest is extremely well done, for both non-coders and coders, but unfortunately, even the best engine (and quest is definately one of the best), there's still a steep learning curve, no matter what, game making and coding, is not easy.

it can be done, but you got to be patient, get excited over very small successes, taking it small step by small step, and slowly those small steps start adding up, and before you know it, you know how to code, hehe

this is my recommendation (how I got to where I am from not knowing anything on how to code):

1. start with the tutorial, trying to do most things successfully within the entire tutorial.
2. the 'character creation' guide, learn it, understand it, do it over and over until it's reflex, lol.
3. learn the basics of coding: 'Attributes' and the 'If' Script.
4. study the other guides and etc code stuff
5. when ready try understanding lists, dictionaries, looping, object types, and etc stuff
6. study more advanced code and guides
7. etc etc etc

Hi and thanks again. The test game is very simple Three rooms, one of which has an invisible and locked exit. Taking the key from room1 then travelling to room 2 and using it should make the exit to room 3 visible and unlock it. Pretty simple ! The code is as follows

<!--Saved by Quest 5.5.5328.26617-->
<asl version="550">
  <include ref="English.aslx" />
  <include ref="Core.aslx" />
  <game name="newgame">
    <gameid>47c964db-8467-4f9e-a19d-b10766765f97</gameid>
    <version>1.0</version>
    <firstpublished>2015</firstpublished>
  </game>
  <object name="room1">
    <inherit name="editor_room" />
    <object name="player">
      <inherit name="editor_object" />
      <inherit name="editor_player" />
    </object>
    <exit to="room2" />
    <object name="key">
      <inherit name="editor_object" />
      <feature_usegive />
      <take />
      <use type="script">
        if (not game.pov.parent = room2) {
          msg ("No lock here !")
        }
        else if () {
          MakeExitVisible (Lock)
          UnlockExit (Lock)
        }
        msg ("No Lock here")
      </use>
    </object>
  </object>
  <object name="room2">
    <inherit name="editor_room" />
    <exit to="room1" />
    <exit name="Lock" to="room3">
      <visible type="boolean">false</visible>
      <locked />
    </exit>
  </object>
  <object name="room3">
    <inherit name="editor_room" />
    <exit to="room2" />
  </object>
</asl>

I cannot for the life of me see how the error statement relates to this and since I 'm not even sure what the language is I can't began to start looking ! The post was generated from the GUI as Neonayon suggested which looked reasonable to me.

GERONIMO !!!!! Figured it out (not with the code though ! The steps suggested by Neonayon)included (at step 16) an If Else statement. I could see no reason for a further IF condition so have used simply ELSE which seemed nore logical and IT WORKS ! only problem now is that when room3 appears it is only in the pane and not as a clickable hyperlink ! But that's a problem for another day and I already have some ideas to try. Meanwhile I am off for some amber fluid and bed .... Thanks for your patience folks... the epic continues !

Your locked exit must have an alias chosen from the combobox "Alias" (no free text)

Glad you were able to figure it out! Good job!

It's little victories like that, that make you feel like someday you make be an expert! Just give yourself time to learn little by little.

Davidmarks wrote:

Also in my opinion at least, understanding the coding logic of how to accomplish what you want is far more important than highly detailed steps to achieve very specific results, as the first will allow you to build a lot more once you understand the basic tools you have available.

I do not entirely agree with for the following reason. I am not familiar with coding but desire to learn. At this early stage all attempts to understand the problem have failed after very many hours , leading as I have said before to almost giving up. The step by step detail so kindly provided by Neonayon will not only allow me to move forward with my game, but I can also look at the code involved to achieve someting which is important to me and by so doing learn more about the coding ..Having said that we all learn in different ways ...Hope all that makes sense .... Now, back to trying to locate that blasted syntax error

The issue here is that there's thousands of 'specific situations' that one might try to implement, and there's no way a tutorial would be able to cover all or even most of them. All they can really do is cover the most common ones and give you a handle on the logic and basic building blocks before turning you loose to use them creatively in any combination you like.

@ Marzipan - Agreed.

Also... nice to hear from you again. It's been a while. Hope all is well.

while its true we can't post infinite tutorials (Marzipan posts so concisely-well, sighs. HK wishes he could be more concise in his posts), we can still post some tutorials that will better help with the transitioning from "the tutorial", to, actually being able to do~implement stuff towards~for making a game, as there's really quite a gap, for those who don't want to and~or who can't learn to code and~or to learn how to bridge that logic-if and etc gap on their own.

Thanks for that .. Is there no way I can choose my own text for the locked door and have it appear in hyperlinks ?

I don't know about the hyperlink, but there are plenty of ways to customize your locked door text.

1st Way:
1. Find your "Lock Door" object. Like, for example, if you create a locked door that has special conditions (like that key from your earlier post) you'll see like that listed under the room.objects contents. I tend to label my locked doors like "Fireplace Door Lock" or "South Exit Lock" so that they stand out and I know where to find them.
2. Click on your "locked" object, and find the "Exit tab", check the "Locked" box, then look to the "Print Message when Locked" and print your customized text. Whenever the player tries to access the door, that message will appear.

2nd Way:
1. Click on your room.object, find the "exit tab", double click on whatever direction your locked exit is in, and that'll bring you to the same screen as the #2 direction above.

I hope that is helpful!

For the hyperlink, you need to work with Commands and~or the "text prcoessor commands" scripting:

Commands:

http://docs.textadventures.co.uk/quest/ ... mmand.html

Verbs are actually a "sub-type" of a Command. Commands are general~global, whereas a Verb is for a specific Object.

---

and also tied into Verbs are the:

'displayverbs' built-in String List Attribute
'inventoryverbs' built-in String List Attribute

http://docs.textadventures.co.uk/quest/ ... ments.html (very brief mentioning of them here, lol)
http://docs.textadventures.co.uk/quest/ ... verbs.html (quest doc link: probably done by Pixie also, lol, but maybe not)
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=4953 (Pixie's "how to use verbs" library)

----------------------------------------------------------------

"text processor commands" :

http://docs.textadventures.co.uk/quest/ ... essor.html

(this is more simple than working with Commands, and it may be all you need for what it sounds like you want to do)